Section 21 Notice after terminating lease with estate agent

Discussion in 'Residential Letting Questions' started by dave103, Nov 18, 2016.

  1. dave103 New Member

    Dear Colleagues

    If I have leased a property to an estate agent ( starting the 22nd September 2015 ) and then the lease was terminated in March 2016, and I want to start the process to evict the the estate agent and sub-tenants who occupy the property - can you please tell me:

    1) Do I have to use the old section 21 notice as the lease started before October 2015, or do I use the new section 21 notice as the lease terminated on March 2016 ( after October 2015 )?.

    2) Is it the fixed term section 21 notice or periodic section 21 notice I serve on the estate agent ?.

    I have scanned and uploaded the lease agreement with the estate agent that was terminated in March 2016.

    Any advice is much appreciated.


  2. Amy C New Member

    Hello Dave,

    It is the old style notice. In relation to which notice, if the tenancy agreement mentions that at the end of the contractual term it will then be a statutory periodic you need to use the (4). If there is no mention then you can use 1(b). I would play it safe and use (4) and have the notice expire at the end of a periodic tenancy.
  3. Jeffrey Shaw Member

    A letting to EA is not within the Housing Act 1988 at all (unless EA in person has an only or principal home at the let property).
    Sub-T's tenancy, created by EA, might be within the Act. But your letting to EA isn't; so it's governed by only common-law contractual rules.
    Use a precedent non-statutory Notice To Quit. Serve it on EA only.
  4. Amy C New Member

    Apologies my fault - I am sure we discussed this Dave when we spoke on the phone. Jeffrey is absolutely right and thanks for correcting.
  5. dave103 New Member

    Dear Jeffrey,

    Thank you for your response and much appreciated.

    1)Is there a site where I can obtain a ‘non-statutory’ notice to quit and how much notice will I have to give the EA in the NTQ?.
    2)If the EA does not remove the occupants in the flat, do I start eviction proceedings in the normal way against EA ?.
    3)The sub-T's were put in to the flat by estate agent 2 (EA2) ( the sub-T's tenancy was created by EA2 and not EA ). Will the Court grant a possession order against EA ?. ( or if my lease agreement with EA provides that there is privity of estate between EA and the sub-T's, is a possession order more likely to be granted ? ).

    Thank you.
  6. Jeffrey Shaw Member

    1. I don't know re websites. You're looking for a common-law Notice To Quit, remember, not a statutory form. The fixed term ended immediately after 21 September 2016. NO continuation rights apply. If the letting continues thereafter, it must be a monthly common-law letting; so give (by Recorded Delivery) at least one month's Notice to EA. This should ideally end immediately after 21st of a month. A NtQ today [8 December] would therefore run up to & inc. 21 January 2017.

    2. Yes. The occupants are not your tenants; it's for EA to terminate their rights.

    3. Your NtQ is served on whoever is your own tenant: presumably EA, rather than EA2.

    But please be aware that online Forum advice is inevitably based on only what you post! If you rely on just this instead of proper paid-for legal advice, you might come a cropper..
  7. dave103 New Member

    Dear Jeffrey,

    Thank you for your reply.
    I have already terminated the lease inside the fixed term by serving a notice ( but not an NTQ ) which terminated the lease on 25th March 2016 ( clause 1 on page 1 allowed me to do this ). So the lease started on the 22nd September 2015 and terminated on the 25th March 2016.
    If I serve a one month NTQ on EA , does this mean the period of the periodic tenancy begins on the 26th March 2016 and finishes on the 25th March April 2016 ?.
    Therefore if I serve an NTQ, EA must receive it for at least one month, with the end of the period expiring on the 25th day of the next month ?.
    ( just want to make sure I get the dates right ).

  8. Jeffrey Shaw Member

    1. Look at the definition of "the Term". It would have ended in September 2016. Your NTQ ended it early, as was your right.
    2. So- after the NTQ came into force- the original Letting was finished for all purposes.
    3. You already know that- being outside the Act- it did not involve any statutory continuation rights.
    4. If T continued to pay rent, that is therefore not referrable to the original Letting but must be a brand-new monthly contractual tenancy.
    5. This new tenancy runs 26th-25th of each calendar month.
    6. Hence, as I told you, the NTQ period should ideally end immediately after a tenancy month.
    7. A NtQ today [14 December] would therefore run up to & inc. 25 January 2017. Legally, it expires just a millisecond "after" the last day ends.
  9. dave103 New Member

    Dear Jeffrey,

    Thank you for your reply.
    1) Are you saying that the lease has been effectively terminated by my notice below ? ( pic attached below ).

    2) In order to commence eviction, I will now have to serve a 'Notice to Quit' ( under the prescribed information regulations 1988 ) to end the new 'monthly contractual tenancy'?.

    Thank you.
  10. Jeffrey Shaw Member

    Yes and yes (respectively). You seem slightly surprised that your Notice To Quit did what it says!

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